No more arrests for pot smoking patients [Archive]

Steve

10-19-2009, 02:55 PM

about fucking time.

this segment is pretty vague, however:
"The guidelines being issued by the department do, however, make it clear that federal agents will go after people whose marijuana distribution goes beyond what is permitted under state law or use medical marijuana as a cover for other crimes."

... what crimes? like selling to people with fake cards/ on good faith? how would the caregivers know?

Brandon

10-19-2009, 03:00 PM

selling weed illegally. Some suppliers use the medicinal sales as a cover for their illegal operation.

Bout time.... you can thank Obama for repealing this bullshit decree the Bush put into place.

..... but I doubt any of the GOP or Conservative right will say anything but negative shit about how this is going to lead to the detriment of all society and baby Jebus is going to smite us all for it.

Erik Mitchell

10-19-2009, 03:02 PM

Hell yes, I wonder what employers would say if you have a medical weed card now?

cybr

10-19-2009, 03:04 PM

That's the only concern I have now.

Steve

10-19-2009, 03:14 PM

Hell yes, I wonder what employers would say if you have a medical weed card now?
That's another sticky issue.

While I agree that discrimination for legitimate MMJ card holders is wrong... if I worked in HR and I interviewed someone who was legitimately prescribed an assload of Oxy/Roxy... I could spot, based on their demeanor, if it would affect their performance. Chances are, many people on heavy opiates wouldn't be hired on my watch. Sucks.. but it's just better for the company.

The question, I suppose, is whether employers should be allowed to have the info about your prescription at all.

Steve

10-19-2009, 03:15 PM

selling weed illegally. Some suppliers use the medicinal sales as a cover for their illegal operation.
They'll be investigated the same way dealers have been since MJ was scheduled... nothing changes.

Neat!

Orangepeel

10-19-2009, 03:31 PM

that slideshow is "dope"

just heard a segment on NPR about this:)

Opm

Neon

10-19-2009, 04:30 PM

The question, I suppose, is whether employers should be allowed to have the info about your prescription at all.

Legally, I don't think they can get that information. I'm pretty sure prescriptions are protected as part of the doctor-patient relationship and therefore nobody can access that information. Plus, I know for a fact an employer is not allowed to ask if a woman is on birth control and since that also requires a prescription, it makes no sense that an employer could ask about a marijuana prescription.

M.I.J.

10-19-2009, 04:34 PM

their line of questioning on the subject goes like this > "pee in the cup"

if you piss hawt for cannabinoid metabolites then you gotta tell them you got the card, if you piss hawt for opiate metabolites you gotta tell them about your prescription.. etc, etc

I heard about this on NPR too, and thought - thats pretty cool! follow the law and get your card for your medical necessity and it seems that everything is a-ok for the feds

Steve

10-19-2009, 04:35 PM

Legally, I don't think they can get that information. I'm pretty sure prescriptions are protected as part of the doctor-patient relationship and therefore nobody can access that information. Plus, I know for a fact an employer is not allowed to ask if a woman is on birth control and since that also requires a prescription, it makes no sense that an employer could ask about a marijuana prescription.
.. but they'll find out via the whizz-quiz to get the job.

Making this much more difficult to legislate.

their line of questioning on the subject goes like this > "pee in the cup"

if you piss hawt for cannabinoid metabolites then you gotta tell them you got the card, if you piss hawt for opiate metabolites you gotta tell them about your prescription.. etc, etc
Right. But opiates have been prescribed since the travelling snake-oil salesman days. They're less stigmatized, and for no logical reason.

nygaard

10-19-2009, 04:50 PM

follow the law and get your card for your medical necessity and it seems that everything is a-ok for the feds

yeah... because we know that ALLLL these stoners are in such pain and anguish and NEED this drug to cope.

The biggest issue is still the abuse in the system. I am not a fellow smoker myself, but have plenty of friends that are. They all got cards for just made up bullshit that the docs dont even check regardless of their made up story. Their experience getting the card was all the same "I walked in and said i have back problems and wala, got a pot card"

None of them have any medical issues or pain whatsoever. So the system is still flawed and the ease/abuse of obtaining a card is going to ruin it for those that ACTUALLY (?)need(?) it.

M.I.J.

10-19-2009, 04:52 PM

i am totally in agreement with you on that point. I have argued past this stupid 'smoke screen' medical BS to many of my friends who are on the medical card bandwagon. Personally, I will not get a card - though it is enticing... i do not have a medical need for the weedz, i just love it very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very very much

Steve

10-19-2009, 04:55 PM

So the system is still flawed and the ease/abuse of obtaining a card is going to ruin it for those that ACTUALLY (?)need(?) it.
The system for obtaining opiates is also quite flawed. It'll get ironed out, and I doubt that abuses of MMJ cards will "ruin" the MMJ situation for those who are truly in need of a prescription.

Interesting video on how flawed opiate prescription policies are:
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<embed src="http://www.hulu.com/embed/mp2XEClFhALCiojVFPbT5A" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" height="296" width="512"></object>

MikeRobot

10-19-2009, 04:59 PM

None of them have any medical issues or pain whatsoever. So the system is still flawed and the ease/abuse of obtaining a card is going to ruin it for those that ACTUALLY (?)need(?) it.

WAH WAH!!!! This has been going on in cally for over 10 years since 1996 it has been legal medically. Regardless of how one gets their card or not nothing is going to change. Marijuanna should be legal across the board anyways and the state is making income off every person that gets registered and has to renew their liscense with the state every year for $90.00 plus tax on the dispensaries. If anything this is helping Colorado and nothing is hurting anything by getting cards easily.

M.I.J.

10-19-2009, 05:04 PM

IMHO it hurts our integrity as citizens of this country... if we want legalized weed then that is what we should work towards.. why hide behind BS medical cards?

dave

10-19-2009, 05:05 PM

what i want to know is, when will prices go down...

my understanding is that they have not gone below the street prices, for the most part....

who's making the bank now if it's not the big bad cartels?
are local growers making better cash now? that could be a good thing... right? a local economy boost/trickle down effect.....
are the illegal distribution networks hurting?

there should be some fall out being felt in the 'underground economy' side of things, right?

M.I.J.

10-19-2009, 05:07 PM

there should be some fall out being felt in the 'underground economy' side of things, right?

lol dave is looking for a new dealer who is having troubles moving their 'product'

hahahahahahaha

dave

10-19-2009, 05:10 PM

nice juan

:third:

MikeRobot

10-19-2009, 05:10 PM

IMHO it hurts our integrity as citizens of this country... if we want legalized weed then that is what we should work towards.. why hide behind BS medical cards?

There is nothing that can be done really accept the government regulating who gets cards and who doesn't. It is essentially on the doctor that writes the go ahead for the cards. There are still lots of grey areas surrounding this stuff, but essentially I am not against the doctor being held liable. There is just no way for the government to get involved unless you have to be diagnosed by a doctor that works for the government. If you compare this to other prescription drugs and people getting them illegally there are a lot more cases of abuse I am 100% sure. With prescription drugs they are addictive and lead to a lot larger problems than MJ. The thing that makes it easy for people to get cards is that the doctor doesn't require any medical records. If medical records where required about said issue needing the MJ than it would be harder.

Steve

10-19-2009, 05:11 PM

lol dave is looking for a new dealer who is having troubles moving their 'product'

hahahahahahaha

CRAZY DEALERZ!!

We're SLASH, SLASH, SLASHING PRICES.

EVERY BAG MUST GO!

:lol::lol::lol::lol:

MikeRobot

10-19-2009, 05:12 PM

what i want to know is, when will prices go down...

my understanding is that they have not gone below the street prices, for the most part..

Not really. But your paying for top of the line professional grown pot. If you write over your caregiver form to them you get better deals. Also you have to know where to go. There are so many places its ridiculous. Look at back of the Westword. It grows every week.

dave

10-19-2009, 05:18 PM

Not really. But your paying for top of the line professional grown pot.

yeah, but everyone in LE says how much violence and whatnot pot dealing causes, and how much the cartels are pulling....

and besides, what's changed... there have been top notch growers here in CO since the 60s according to my 'dead' aunt..... (who i choose not to name)

were they being dishonest with the american taxpayers? oh the horror...

know what i'm saying?

;)

jCole

10-19-2009, 05:19 PM

While I don't smoke pot, I'm definitely all for this.

One step closer to full legalization!

cthabeerman

10-19-2009, 06:30 PM

if we want legalized weed then that is what we should work towards.. why hide behind BS medical cards?

Medical marijuana provides a gateway (:lol:) for such legislation. Don't think there won't be future surveys done regarding MM users and crime. If all goes swell there, i.e. all these licensed folks don't get in trouble with the law in any prevalent way, then there's not much legal ground for outlawing the drug.

If you can show that the behavioral aspect of marijuana is positive, or at least neutral, the next logical step is to remove the criminal aspect entirely by eliminating grow/sale laws.

If we're lucky, surveys of that sort (along with the older generation getting weeded-out of the voting pool via death) should allow pro-pot legislation to get pushed through on all governmental levels.

-C

Luv

10-19-2009, 07:38 PM

Hell yes, I wonder what employers would say if you have a medical weed card now?

The company I am currently employed by - S A F E W A Y - follows the federal law. They don't care if a doc has told you that weed will benefit your ailment. They want their employees to get prescriptions - man-made chemicals, so you buy it from their pharmacy so they make $$. :ohwell::frown:
Greedy bastards!

Brandon

10-19-2009, 09:54 PM

.. but they'll find out via the whizz-quiz to get the job.

Making this much more difficult to legislate.
There inlies the flaw with the person that wants to seek gainful employment AND a medicinal card/license.

Employers are allowed to fire someone for testing positive for marijuana EVEN IF THEY HAVE A MEDICINAL PERMIT. Because the Controlled Substances Act considers marijuana to not have medicinal value, it can't be considered a medicine under the law, so even a doctor's note won't negate a positive test, like a note would for Vicodin or Oxy.

Sucks, but that's the world we live in... baby steps.

dave

10-20-2009, 09:45 AM

There inlies the flaw with the person that wants to seek gainful employment AND a medicinal card/license.

Employers are allowed to fire someone for testing positive for marijuana EVEN IF THEY HAVE A MEDICINAL PERMIT. Because the Controlled Substances Act considers marijuana to not have medicinal value, it can't be considered a medicine under the law, so even a doctor's note won't negate a positive test, like a note would for Vicodin or Oxy.

Sucks, but that's the world we live in... baby steps.

do the thc pills/other consumables and smoked/vaped MMJ show up differently in urine?

Brandon

10-20-2009, 09:50 AM

I don't think the tests work like that... I think they look for X, Y and Z elements in the sample; if the elements are in there, the test is positive. I don't know that intaking thc in different methods changes how it's stored/registered in the body.

grapeape

10-20-2009, 09:53 AM

yeah... because we know that ALLLL these stoners are in such pain and anguish and NEED this drug to cope.

The biggest issue is still the abuse in the system. I am not a fellow smoker myself, but have plenty of friends that are. They all got cards for just made up bullshit that the docs dont even check regardless of their made up story. Their experience getting the card was all the same "I walked in and said i have back problems and wala, got a pot card"

None of them have any medical issues or pain whatsoever. So the system is still flawed and the ease/abuse of obtaining a card is going to ruin it for those that ACTUALLY (?)need(?) it.

abuse of the benign "drug" on the planet.....plz shut it.

BeatFreq

10-20-2009, 09:57 AM

yeah, who gives a fuck if it is recreational? do we need a medical excuse to get beer when we want to unwind on the weekend? should i need a prescription to get wine with my meal?

Brandon

10-20-2009, 09:58 AM

abuse of the benign "drug" on the planet.
That's a subjective statement, at best.

Brandon

10-20-2009, 09:59 AM

yeah, who gives a fuck if it is recreational? do we need a medical excuse to get beer when we want to unwind on the weekend? should i need a prescription to get wine with my meal?
No, because the prohitibion act was repealed.

You get Congress to alter the Controlled Substances Act (like Ron Paul is trying to do) and booze will be the same as weed. Until that happens, expect stringent regulation.

grapeape

10-20-2009, 10:02 AM

That's a subjective statement, at best.

I think its a lot better statement than the subjective post that I responded to.

Brandon

10-20-2009, 10:07 AM

I think its a lot better statement than the subjective post that I responded to.
Fair enough. I still don't know that I'd call it benign; maybe criminally, but not in totality.

BeatFreq

10-20-2009, 10:17 AM

Fair enough. I still don't know that I'd call it benign; maybe criminally, but not in totality.

well sure, but i don't know that i'd call red meat benign in totality. should we be stringently regulating it?

grapeape

10-20-2009, 10:21 AM

personal testimony time.

i started smoking when I was 16. I graduated high school ON WEED. Varsity letterman in 2 HS Sports ON WEED. Was extended a full ride scholarship ON WEED. Graduated from said college cum laude in Chem Eng. ON WEED. Have had two successful professional jobs ON WEED. Many potential employers I want to apply to and am fully qualified for I cannot because im ON WEED after work and they have stringent drug testing...like random hair tests.

Drunks get drunk everyday....yet would never be sniffed out by the scrutiny of the fabulous fast 5 drug kit.....even better it doesn't identify powders after 72 hrs.

I get ON WEED everyday
plz hush or be quiet or shut it....or better yet unfairly scrutinize my personal life and worry less about job performance.

There might be some of those kids on the TV commercials that never leave there mothers basement....but there are many like me.....and even more basement ridden drunks.

I think the real issue is issurance companies want an excuse to deny coverage for anyway possible.

dave

10-20-2009, 10:24 AM

There might be some of those kids on the TV commercials that never leave there mothers basement....but there are many like me.....

my wife and i were discussing this a few years ago...
saying, 'there must be a fairly large % of 'older or middle aged adults' in this area that voted for this, for it to pass....'

Brandon

10-20-2009, 10:33 AM

well sure, but i don't know that i'd call red meat benign in totality. should we be stringently regulating it?
I guess it depends... eating red meat isn't going to impare your driving or operating machinery, as weed can. I think that there are some things like booze and weed that need to be controlled more, for the greater good of society.

Hell, booze is regulated and look how many drunk driving deaths there are? Would loosening the weed regulations create the same issues? We have to conclude that there would be some increase in accidents/death from DWI on weed, since it does impact the reaction time.

grapeape

10-20-2009, 10:35 AM

The weed test is hot whether u are high or not. The breathalyzer does not do this.

plz shut it

Brandon

10-20-2009, 10:37 AM

The weed test is hot whether u are high or not. The breathalyzer does not do this.

plz shut it
If you want to discuss this, I suggest you drop the 'plz shut it' from your replies. Show a little respect.

grapeape

10-20-2009, 10:41 AM

I'm sick of people who don't smoke knowing so much about weed. plz continue enlightening me.

Brandon

10-20-2009, 10:43 AM

I'm sick of people who don't smoke knowing so much about weed. plz continue enlightening me.
Maybe you need to know who you're talking to and their knowledge on the subject before you make such statements. Just because you smoke doesn't make you an expert on the subject, so don't dillute yourself.

grapeape

10-20-2009, 10:47 AM

u should talk about techno, i can tell from your mixes you're good at that. :)

Brandon

10-20-2009, 10:48 AM

lol thx. Techno is just a front... I'm really a Mexican smuggler. ;)

M.I.J.

10-20-2009, 11:15 AM

lol.. i only know one chem engineer in Denver's electronica culture who burns it on the regular (there could be more, but I know this one forsure), we have discussed his points in person, he knows where i stand on this issue - yeah its bullshit that us smokers are discriminated against for jobs that we are totally qualified for just because we burn it..

I'll restate my claim though, political mobilization for total decriminalization is the way - we shouldn't have to hide behind the medical issue

BeatFreq

10-20-2009, 11:23 AM

I guess it depends... eating red meat isn't going to impare your driving or operating machinery, as weed can.

as can the tryptophan in turkey.

Brandon

10-20-2009, 11:24 AM

yeah its bullshit that us smokers are discriminated against for jobs that we are totally qualified for just because we burn it..

I completely agree. Of course, the only issue I find with the smoking is because it stays in the system so long, how do you know that it's affecting you or can affect you?

Brandon

10-20-2009, 11:24 AM

as can the tryptophan in turkey.
Lemme know the next time someone dies from an accident related to tryptophan. ;)

BeatFreq

10-20-2009, 11:25 AM

Lemme know the next time someone dies from an accident related to tryptophan. ;)

would that i could, but they never test for it ;)

but thanksgiving is generally a big weekend for auto accidents...

M.I.J.

10-20-2009, 11:33 AM

I completely agree. Of course, the only issue I find with the smoking is because it stays in the system so long, how do you know that it's affecting you or can affect you?

like i mentioned before, the test only tests for metabolites left over from an 'active' stoning. There is some documentation that says the effects of THC only last for 6 hours or so - but the metabolites any drug test tests for stay in a person's system for up to 6 weeks depending on many variables.

now, there are plenty of psychological studies out there that show a negative correlation between memory function and THC intake so I will not attempt at arguing that the weedz has no effect on cognition

the drizzle

10-20-2009, 11:40 AM

i was a chemical operator for uniroyal...we worked with crazy high flashpoint shit that could blow up a town,CS2..we worked with MNA,rocket fuel component, that could turn the water supply yellow...

i was drug tested because what if: i was baked and forgot to set the cooling temp on a tank, or forgot to stop adding chemicals to a mixed batch? BOOM! bye bye naugatuck, ct.

i couldve destroyed a town and killed thousands of people.

so, the company protects themselves and the town by drug testing.

it does matter to an extent what you do in yr personal life...
if you smoke too much crack on the weekends or get too drunk on weekends or whatever...it can affect your work performance and the lives and safety of others.

so for me, drug testing is totally legit. even though i smoked everyday...one fuckup couldve and shouldve gotten me fired. so if it turns up on my screening for the job exam, the 1st piss test, that i am a stoner---why would they hire me?

fuck i think half the people i talk to in customer service depts are stupid on smack the way they perform, i'd hate to see them handle dangerous equipment.

cybr

10-20-2009, 11:57 AM

u should talk about techno, i can tell from your mixes you're good at that. :)

lol. win.

Erik Mitchell

10-20-2009, 11:59 AM

as can the tryptophan in turkey.

That's a myth yo! :ranger:

:backaway:

the drizzle

10-20-2009, 12:01 PM

i should never drive after thanksgiving. i go from table, to couch and football, to asleep in less than 2 hrs.

Brandon

10-20-2009, 12:07 PM

people drive on Thanksiving? shit, I barely make it off the couch :)

BeatFreq

10-20-2009, 01:05 PM

Anyways, the whole issue is beside the point. If you want to claim that use should be regulated because of those cases in which people might be performing dangerous work or operating heavy machinery like automobiles,sure, handle it on that level when those people go to apply for that work or get licensed to operate their cars. I don't own a car or do dangerous work, so what's the rationale for making sure I don't light up when settling in for an evening in the studio?